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Old 06-17-2017, 04:33 PM   #1
Rcplanes13
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Default Rc plane help

A while ago i bought the nitroplanes fiberglass f4 phantom and have been working on it, but cannot seem to get it to move. Is it a weight problem? It might weigh around 7 to 10 pounds, but i am using the recommended jets: 70mm which are 3000kv each and it seems to be powerful like it wants to move but can't. Is 3000kv enough? I have covered every air spot so it is air tight. Really need help!
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Old 06-17-2017, 05:01 PM   #2
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Couple of questions....:

Is this the RFT version.....everything included TX/RX, just had to snap together and bind....?

Are you using the recommended battery size/output....?...All the NitroPlanes reviews show this model flying with stock suggested 14.8v/2100mAh/20c battery.

Once TX/RX are in sync.....and you've checked all surface controls, when you bench test the throttle, you have a full range of throttle....?

Are both 70mm fans turning in the same direction.......have not accidently reversed one or both fan rotations........?

Since you've stated you have clean and positive air flow, no restrictions, let's see the what's next.....
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Old 06-17-2017, 05:41 PM   #3
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Several questions and suggestions
www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?2906625-Rc-plane-help

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Old 06-17-2017, 07:30 PM   #4
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Rcplanes13
....cannot seem to get it to move
If the plane is sitting on its undercarriage and on a reasonably smooth flat surface and it simply refuses to move then something very seriously wrong and it will never fly.
Even at 10 lbs all up a pair of modest 70 mm EDF on a 4s should deliver near to 4 lbs of thrust which should make it roll along quite nicely even if it does not fly.
Could you actually weight it on a set of bathroom scales?
Some pictures might also help identify where the problem lies.
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Old 06-17-2017, 07:46 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by ron_van_sommeren View Post
Thanks Ron..........the link puts all in perspective.......on to bigger and better things.......
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Old 06-17-2017, 07:54 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by pizzano View Post
Thanks Ron..........the link puts all in perspective.......on to bigger and better things.......
He is a waste of time.

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Old 06-17-2017, 09:14 PM   #7
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I was able to make it move once, not fast or anything, but it was able to go and maybe partical of it was where i put the batteries, but i tried that and it did not work, but it wanted to move
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Old 06-17-2017, 10:13 PM   #8
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Attachment 185399

Attachment 185400
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Old 06-18-2017, 01:00 AM   #9
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Those old 25c exceed batteries look pretty dated. When you say "a while ago", how long are we talking? What are the battery voltages currently?

I would save this model for after you gain more experience. These are first week questions being asked for an advanced aircraft.

I don't have a short temper. I just have a quick reaction to B.S.
Rob
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Old 06-18-2017, 01:13 AM   #10
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By a while ago, i meant 3 summers. I dont have any clubs around my area or people to talk to about this stuff, so its hard to find out what the problem is or what might be causing it. I have a charger and keep them in use about 11v right now.
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Old 06-18-2017, 01:20 AM   #11
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Parking brake on?
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Old 06-18-2017, 01:55 AM   #12
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It does have one
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Old 06-18-2017, 02:03 AM   #13
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You need to familiarize yourself with Lipo batteries, and buy the correct charger. You are currently below LVC value and this is causing your system to reserve the minimal amount of remaining battery voltage for BEC function, well that and not allow your batteries to become destroyed.

11 / 4 = 2.75vpc. Your batteries are dead.

I don't have a short temper. I just have a quick reaction to B.S.
Rob
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Old 06-18-2017, 02:07 AM   #14
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Sorry meant to say it "doesn't have one". Will do they seemed to be acting wierd for a while, how long does the average 14.8v battery last for a rc plane? (As in flight time)
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Old 06-18-2017, 02:11 AM   #15
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Buy a trainer.

I don't have a short temper. I just have a quick reaction to B.S.
Rob
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Old 06-18-2017, 05:24 AM   #16
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There really hasn't been really good flyable F4 made and believe me, I'm a huge fan of the Phantom . FMS had a small 64mm that wasn't too bad. The full scale was known as the Brick if that gives you a clue. Your way over your head if you think you'll be able to fly the F4.

Clearly not a first plane or even a second. Start with a high wing trainer. Plenty of deals out there. Check RC Groups classifieds. From there, graduate to a low wing like the Eflight T-28. After you master those then you may be ready for an edf. There's easy to fly edf's and not so easy to fly edf's. The Freewing F-86 is pretty easy. The Freewing F5 can bite you in a heartbeat.

If you plan on being in the hobby for a while get a simulator. Real flight or Phoenix. Can find used. Very helpful especially if you're not near a club.

Good luck

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Old 06-18-2017, 08:45 AM   #17
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OK - I stayed quiet as I didn't want to appear as a killjoy ....

Question to RCPlanes13 ....

1. Is this first RC model ?

2. What radio and other gear do you have to fly this F4 ?

3. What charger do you have ?

4. Do you have a simulator ? No need to spend huge money on this - Clear view is very good and a fraction of Real flight / Phoenix price.

5. Have you checked out any web pages talking about use of lipo battery's in models ?

I had idea from first post that it was a new pilot situation. The F4 in any form is a bad starter plane and will only lead to dissapointment.

Nigel

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Old 06-18-2017, 11:37 AM   #18
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Picking up on what the others have already made.

(Sorry in advance if this comes accross as negative, it really isn't, it's just good honest advice)

If this is your first RC plane then just put it away somewhere safe and only get it out again once you have learned how to fly RC planes at an advanced level. Start with a basic trainer and then move through a fast sports/aerobatic model before thinking about flying the F4. In the world of 'real' planes pilots dont learn to fly on an F4 Phantom and it's no different in the world of RC planes. If it is your first plane then the only reason it's still in one piece is that you havent got it to move fast enough to crash, plain and simple.

If your batteries are 4 cell (14.8V) and are now measuring 11V they are over-discharged and need to go in the trash can.... sorry.

As for your question about 'how long' (flight time) does a 14.8V LiPo last... That would be somewhere between 2 minutes and 2 hours+, depending on type of model and size of battery and how aggressively the model is flown. A ducted fan scale jet would usually be 5 minutes or less because they are very inefficient. An average sports/aerobatic model is maybe 10 minutes or so, sailplanes can pretty much be up as long as you like in the right conditions.
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Old 06-18-2017, 11:44 AM   #19
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Well thanks anyway for all the help, learned alot in the process. I probably just work on other stuff in the meantime. My original plan was to get it fixed or at least able to move and learn to fly better before trying to attempt this.

Thanks for all the help!
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Old 06-18-2017, 06:15 PM   #20
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Default Rcplane

No matter what i need batteries, they keep dying quickly

Couldnt get a video of it, but it was to show that i would put it at full throttle and nothing happened. This is the transmitter i am using. Should i consider buying a battery and fan that can produce the right amount of thrust? What about an esc?
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Old 06-18-2017, 06:23 PM   #21
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Id have to check again, but if the fans were spinning opposite, what would i do? I dont think they are, but it was raining, so i couldn't check really. Another problem i am noticing is that when i start to move the throttle, one fan would spin normally while the other is trying to spin. Then it would kick on after i stop and push the throttle again.
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Old 06-18-2017, 06:34 PM   #22
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There is no point trying to test it if the batteries are dead. If you fully charge the batteries they should read close to 16.8V. For a 4S LiPo the minimum voltage is about 12V. If they have been discharged down to 11V then most likely the charger wont be able to re-charge them.

For what it's worth, if the fans spin in reverse all you have to do is swap ant two of the three wires that go between ESC and motor, it makes no difference which two you swap.

No point buying more batteries or fans at the moment because the plane is simply not suitable for a beginner, no way, no how. Buy a trainer, the batteries for the trainer will be different anyway.
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Old 06-18-2017, 06:35 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Rcplanes13 View Post
No matter what i need batteries, they keep dying quickly

Couldnt get a video of it, but it was to show that i would put it at full throttle and nothing happened. This is the transmitter i am using. Should i consider buying a battery and fan that can produce the right amount of thrust? What about an esc?
Well, we now know that you are using an old FlySky transmitter (most likely the one that came with the RTF F4.........When I started in RC heli's that same receiver came with nearly all NitroPlanes knock off RTF heli's.........

As far as batteries go.....you've now switched from craft application to transmitter application.......two separate issues............get rid of that transmitter.....nothing but complete headaches.........not even suggested for anything worth keeping in the air.

Put the fan model on ice......get a decent trainer and modern transmitter, some fresh batteries and maybe a SIM..........Re-boot your enthusiasm and start to enjoy yourself........maybe then the questions you'll come back with will help us steer you in a more positive and resourceful direction........keep at it, crawl, walk......then run. Less bruises and frustration.
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Old 06-18-2017, 06:44 PM   #24
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Your right, i'll take my mind off of it by focusing on something else. Once again, thanks for the help
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Old 06-18-2017, 07:04 PM   #25
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Flying a trainer successfully will be fun! Crashing an EDF in the first minute of flight, not so fun.

The knowledge acquired by visiting forums such as this, reading manuals that are supplied with the models and experience gained from starting with a trainer, designed for a beginners success, will come together over time. Many of the respondents to this post have been involved with electric flight for over a decade and are still learning things. Rushing generally ends in unhappiness.

I don't have a short temper. I just have a quick reaction to B.S.
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