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FAA Registration Deadline Looming

Old 04-26-2016, 02:08 PM
  #51  
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The real origin of the problems was the development of FPV.
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Old 04-26-2016, 02:58 PM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by fhhuber View Post
The real origin of the problems was the development of FPV.
FH I love ya like a brother but its blanket statements like that just grinds my gears because it s so untrue. This hobby has had it "rule followers" and "non rule follower," "AMA members" and "non AMA members" etc etc etc for years. In fact this is the only hobby I have seen so busy pointing the finger at each other its no wonder we have let the govt run a muck. The time of arguing how "you fell into the hole" is over. The time is to "figure a way out of the hole" before the FAA caps said hole. This hobby needs to pull it "Holier than though head out of his its 3 point of contact" and stick together or its destined to fail. At the end of the day we fly toys gentleman period.
Rant over
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Old 04-26-2016, 04:51 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by fhhuber View Post
The real origin of the problems was the development of FPV.
Originally Posted by Fishbonez View Post
FH I love ya like a brother but its blanket statements like that just grinds my gears because it s so untrue. This hobby has had it "rule followers" and "non rule follower," "AMA members" and "non AMA members" etc etc etc for years. In fact this is the only hobby I have seen so busy pointing the finger at each other its no wonder we have let the govt run a muck. The time of arguing how "you fell into the hole" is over. The time is to "figure a way out of the hole" before the FAA caps said hole. This hobby needs to pull it "Holier than though head out of his its 3 point of contact" and stick together or its destined to fail. At the end of the day we fly toys gentleman period.
Rant over
I think (and I'm certain someone will correct me if I'm wrong) that what was meant was that FPV technology became the factor that has enabled the idiots to create the situation we are now facing. Prior to FPV, they were unable to fly their crafts (of any description) beyond LOS, at least while still being able to retrieve them.

FPV didn't create the idiots. It's just made it easier for them to do idiotic things. Not all FPV pilots are idiots.
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Old 04-26-2016, 05:30 PM
  #54  
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If memory serves correctly......the last two UAV craft to crash the White House lawns (we have been informed of) WERE NOT FPV.......the technology has certainly made it easier for those who disregard other's privacy and safety to disrupt lives and protocol to a greater extent.......but those same idiots have been doing it without FPV for years......we probably all have known of or have unknowingly been associated in some fashion with a few of those types if you've been in this hobby long enough.........
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Old 04-26-2016, 06:31 PM
  #55  
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Me thinks the gene pool has become disastrously diluted
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Old 04-26-2016, 06:41 PM
  #56  
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I realize I am new here, but I have been in the hobby many years and have been watching/dealing with this for almost that long.

I did not renew my AMA this year, after calculating how much I have paid in dues over the years I don't feel the money I have contributed has been used properly, and I don't feel I or others have gotten what they have paid for. I have seen first hand how good the insurance is, and it frankly is not worth paying for IMHO. I feel the AMA's interest in fixed wing or helis has faded, and the only thing they talk about anymore is multirotors.

More and more, I think everything that is going on right now with the FAA, registering, etc. has been planned for years. I also feel that this hobby has been set up to self-destruct...which I also feel is happening all around, and it is quite easy to to see really. Everyone is fighting each other, because it really is too late to fight anything else.

This is an interesting article, notice the date...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ver-u-s-skies/

The recent plastic bag/"drone" incident only matters to those in the hobby...the damage has been done because the general public only hears "drone", they don't care if it was a plastic bag.

Possibly I am wrong, but I think in time it will be more easy to see.
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Old 04-26-2016, 06:51 PM
  #57  
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I think you are more correct than most people dare to, or care to, say.
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Old 04-26-2016, 08:29 PM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by P51 fan View Post
...This is an interesting article, notice the date...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ver-u-s-skies/
I have to point out that there is not one single specific mention of non commercial UAS users. Yeah, that's us. The hobbyists. They don't even acknowledge our existence.
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Old 04-26-2016, 09:02 PM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by firemanbill View Post
I think you are more correct than most people dare to, or care to, say.
I would like to be completely wrong, but looking at it differently then most I don't know.

I have to point out that there is not one single specific mention of non commercial UAS users. Yeah, that's us. The hobbyists. They don't even acknowledge our existence.
Well, they actually do in the "airspace access" chart, we are in the basic...or lowest...catagory. "LOS in predefined low risk locations", I would have to assume predefined low risk locations are the AMA sanctioned fields that haven't been shut down...yet. Many have been shut down already.

I suppose higher tech R/C devices would fall in the "Good"(Basic+) catagory.

Also, with the FAA and NASA now working together and conducting tests with multiple drones flying together on predetermined flightpaths it looks like us little R/C pilots are just a nuisance, and weeding us out or herding us to specific areas keeps us out of the way.
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Old 04-27-2016, 01:35 AM
  #60  
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Yes, I know where we fit in but NO, they do not mention us.

Do you see hobbyist mentioned here?

Kimchi is calling for airspace under 200 feet to be designated for low-speed localized traffic. Drones in this space might be surveying, shooting videos or conducting inspections.
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Old 04-27-2016, 10:19 AM
  #61  
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Yes I understand...I was trying to point out that they have already placed us, so we technically are "mentioned" but according to their ideas we aren't part of their plans.
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Old 04-27-2016, 12:05 PM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by fhhuber View Post
The real origin of the problems was the development of FPV.
A one size fits all approach is rarely accurate. That usually causes rifts, divisions, and stereotypes.
Originally Posted by Fishbonez View Post
FH I love ya like a brother but its blanket statements like that just grinds my gears because it s so untrue. This hobby has had it "rule followers" and "non rule follower," "AMA members" and "non AMA members" etc etc etc for years. In fact this is the only hobby I have seen so busy pointing the finger at each other its no wonder we have let the govt run a muck. The time of arguing how "you fell into the hole" is over. The time is to "figure a way out of the hole" before the FAA caps said hole. This hobby needs to pull it "Holier than though head out of his its 3 point of contact" and stick together or its destined to fail. At the end of the day we fly toys gentleman period.
Rant over
+1. Playing the blame game and grouping people into categories isn't doing the hobby any good. Nothing positive comes from this.

Originally Posted by Bald Paul View Post
I think (and I'm certain someone will correct me if I'm wrong) that what was meant was that FPV technology became the factor that has enabled the idiots to create the situation we are now facing. Prior to FPV, they were unable to fly their crafts (of any description) beyond LOS, at least while still being able to retrieve them.

FPV didn't create the idiots. It's just made it easier for them to do idiotic things. Not all FPV pilots are idiots.
Something that the "traditional" modeler, or at least those that bemoan the advent of multi-rotors almost never acknowledge is that FPV was going on for years before MR came into popularity. How was that possible? Well, the gear was attached to none other than traditional fixed wing aircraft and flown well out of vsol, sometimes up to 10,000 feet. Ironically, the fixed wing aircraft were able to go higher and farther than the MR's because of the wings. And yet, the criticism almost always is made against "drones" as a whole.
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Old 04-27-2016, 12:10 PM
  #63  
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Originally Posted by Turner View Post
I have to point out that there is not one single specific mention of non commercial UAS users. Yeah, that's us. The hobbyists. They don't even acknowledge our existence.
That's because Amazon and the rest of the big boys (Walmart, NASA, Google) don't care about us. Oh, Intel too...a huge player in this. I'm baffled at the fact that the ardent anti drone folks almost never point to that article or that situation and recognize that as a reason the FAA is knee deep in this issue. It was never a errant drone user, or the AMAs acceptance of MR that triggered the FAA to get involved, it was the fact that left unchecked, all of these big business interests would wreak havoc in our skies, in the interest of commerce and profits.
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Old 04-27-2016, 01:05 PM
  #64  
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Amazon said they could deliver everything I needed for my home by drone - so I placed an order......
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Old 04-27-2016, 04:27 PM
  #65  
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Originally Posted by Bald Paul View Post
Amazon said they could deliver everything I needed for my home by drone - so I placed an order......
HAHA!
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Old 04-27-2016, 04:45 PM
  #66  
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"Something that the "traditional" modeler, or at least those that bemoan the advent of multi-rotors almost never acknowledge is that FPV was going on for years before MR came into popularity. How was that possible? Well, the gear was attached to none other than traditional fixed wing aircraft and flown well out of vsol, sometimes up to 10,000 feet. Ironically, the fixed wing aircraft were able to go higher and farther than the MR's because of the wings. And yet, the criticism almost always is made against "drones" as a whole."

Like I said previously.........:

If memory serves correctly......the last two UAV craft to crash the White House lawns (we have been informed of) WERE NOT FPV.......the technology has certainly made it easier for those who disregard other's privacy and safety to disrupt lives and protocol to a greater extent.......but those same idiots have been doing it without FPV for years......we probably all have known of or have unknowingly been associated in some fashion with a few of those types if you've been in this hobby long enough...................................
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Old 04-27-2016, 07:09 PM
  #67  
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Originally Posted by Bald Paul View Post
Amazon said they could deliver everything I needed for my home by drone - so I placed an order......
Lol! I wonder how that worked out when they dropped it from 400'.

Then of course, there is advertising to get people that really have no clue about anything excited...this "drone" looks awful suspicious to me, like a fan in a lamp shade lowered by string. But, that isn't what the general public sees, they don't care about anything else.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIY1fxcxA4o
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Old 04-27-2016, 07:11 PM
  #68  
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Originally Posted by pizzano View Post
"Something that the "traditional" modeler, or at least those that bemoan the advent of multi-rotors almost never acknowledge is that FPV was going on for years before MR came into popularity. How was that possible? Well, the gear was attached to none other than traditional fixed wing aircraft and flown well out of vsol, sometimes up to 10,000 feet. Ironically, the fixed wing aircraft were able to go higher and farther than the MR's because of the wings. And yet, the criticism almost always is made against "drones" as a whole."

Like I said previously.........:

If memory serves correctly......the last two UAV craft to crash the White House lawns (we have been informed of) WERE NOT FPV.......the technology has certainly made it easier for those who disregard other's privacy and safety to disrupt lives and protocol to a greater extent.......but those same idiots have been doing it without FPV for years......we probably all have known of or have unknowingly been associated in some fashion with a few of those types if you've been in this hobby long enough...................................
Everything said here, quoted and re-quoted, proves what I said about this hobby being set up to self destruct. Why are you arguing...and what do you hope to achieve by arguing?

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Old 04-28-2016, 02:06 AM
  #69  
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Originally Posted by fhhuber View Post
The real origin of the problems was the development of FPV.
This makes one wonder if the FAA got PO'd when the judges threw out the $10,000 fine against "Trappy" in this video. Just try to count how many safety rules this character broke.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZnJeuAja-4

It appears that Trappy settled for a $1,000 fine, without admitting to any guilt.
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Old 04-28-2016, 04:04 AM
  #70  
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Originally Posted by kyleservicetech View Post
This makes one wonder if the FAA got PO'd when the judges threw out the $10,000 fine against "Trappy" in this video. Just try to count how many safety rules this character broke.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZnJeuAja-4

It appears that Trappy settled for a $1,000 fine, without admitting to any guilt.
That is the root of the problem. Government officials really don't like to lose, and the television media is very happy to report drone mis-deeds. Over and over again to sensationalize the act. Gets more ratings.
Doesn't make the FAA look good.

Next problem was when attempting to put rules on the books to stop people like trappy, they had to include all radio controlled models or it would be discrimination.

The FAA really doesn't care about line of sight model airplanes, I've asked a few inspectors and they'd prefer to run away from them, but how would you write the rules so that they would be non discriminatory and still be able to punish( make an example of ) the idiots that fly in the wrong places?
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Old 04-28-2016, 05:03 AM
  #71  
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Originally Posted by kyleservicetech View Post
This makes one wonder if the FAA got PO'd when the judges threw out the $10,000 fine against "Trappy" in this video. Just try to count how many safety rules this character broke.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZnJeuAja-4

It appears that Trappy settled for a $1,000 fine, without admitting to any guilt.
Yes, I believe it had something to do with it, but keep in mind his actions were just a small sliver compared to the thousands of people AND companies doing the same thing at the time...and some still are.

Just because he was singled out and got the equivelent of a hangnail for punishment, he wasn't the only one doing it. I am not sticking up for him, I have absolutely zero time for him and others that were associated with him, but the reason we have such an onslaught of irresponsible R/C pilots in the hobby these days isn't just because of him...and it really isn't the fault of multicopters, FPV, fixed wing, or any other single example...it is because people were shown how to be stupid and then pointed to the easy to get/easy to build products, others made and are still making money from that.

Need proof? Just watch that video, and click on videos to follow...read the comments. 90% are from idiots that saw something cool or dangerous and then wanted to do it themselves.

Companies said "Here, buy this...and go be stupid...crash it and come buy another...". Too easy.
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Old 04-28-2016, 01:58 PM
  #72  
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that's exactly it. This hobby used to take skill, determination and the willingness to part with lots of your money before you got good enough at it to do stupid stuff. By then you had spent way to much on it to do stupid stuff.

Now it is just to easy. Open a box, charge a battery and go be stupid.
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Old 04-29-2016, 12:30 PM
  #73  
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Originally Posted by Bald Paul View Post
Amazon said they could deliver everything I needed for my home by drone - so I placed an order......
Now THAT is a mobile home.
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Old 04-29-2016, 12:39 PM
  #74  
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Originally Posted by firemanbill View Post
that's exactly it. This hobby used to take skill, determination and the willingness to part with lots of your money before you got good enough at it to do stupid stuff. By then you had spent way to much on it to do stupid stuff.

Now it is just to easy. Open a box, charge a battery and go be stupid.
Really? So it's a money and skill issue?

Do you know many "traditional" modelers that could scratch build a MR or UAV from the ground up? I'm not talking about buying a DJI Phantom and trying to fly, I mean building a MR from a box of parts. Keep in mind, not just anyone can get one of these things flying without any effort, they all require some flying skills, as well as the initial set up of the unit. But back to the build.

The frame, the motors, wiring of the esc's, the flight control system, the cameras, etc etc. It's no easy task. And that's just with an FPV racer, go the UAV route with GPS, gyro stab systems, etc etc...far more difficult.
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Old 04-29-2016, 01:29 PM
  #75  
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Originally Posted by Porcia83 View Post
Really? So it's a money and skill issue?

Do you know many "traditional" modelers that could scratch build a MR or UAV from the ground up? I'm not talking about buying a DJI Phantom and trying to fly, I mean building a MR from a box of parts. Keep in mind, not just anyone can get one of these things flying without any effort, they all require some flying skills, as well as the initial set up of the unit. But back to the build.

The frame, the motors, wiring of the esc's, the flight control system, the cameras, etc etc. It's no easy task. And that's just with an FPV racer, go the UAV route with GPS, gyro stab systems, etc etc...far more difficult.
IMHO, I'd like to think that the modelers as described here are not the folks that are causing the problems the FAA is concerned about.
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