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Old 03-01-2015, 09:01 PM   #1
solentlife
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Default Angry Bird ...

So a sheet of 6mm Depron ... a bit of string and a pen ...

Two 50cm discs of depron ... one forms vertical ... other provides basis for 'wing' ....

Offcuts for appendages ...



Span is about 48cm ....

Motor is HK's Donkey 2204 1550kv ... with 8x6 GWS flexy prop and planned to use 3S 800 - 1300 lipo.

Controls are Elevons and Rudder + throttle of course.



Just got to get some yellow for the 'beak' !!

Now just before anyone asks ... there are NO plans !! I built based on a photo I took of a pals who flew at the local site ...



I scaled mine up a bit as his was 2S powered and I only have 3S stuff as my smallest ...

Maiden ? Got to wait for weather to break !!

Nigel

222kph PKJ,EDF Concorde, Mini4,Mig3,T45,PKJ twin,ME109,Edge540,Cessna182,Skymaster Biplane,F15,F16,Badius,Ultimate,SE5,Qbee10,450 Heli,V911,J3 Cub Founder 9x forum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Flysky_RC_radio/
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Old 03-02-2015, 06:51 PM   #2
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Using 4ch Rx and an Elevon Mixer .... - simple way !! I set her up with CoG about 10mm behind prop slot ..... what appeared to be safe position !

Went out - motor is crap to be honest - it doesn't pull anything like HK reckons ... AUW with 800 3S is 305gr and the Donkey motor on 8x6 GWS is nowhere near 1:1 ... swapped to 7x5 APC ... better but still not 1:1 ...

Launched and she stood on her tail ! Motor not being strong enough - she fell out. Tried her three times with varying amounts of DOWN etc. .... ended up breaking her in a few places - so hot-glue and she's now got a 1300 3S up front to pull CoG fwd ... That also makes the motor spin up a bit better with the better C rating. But its still not 1:1 ... I have another motor - but that's earmarked for my Hummer that's coming ...

Will try again maybe tmrw ...

Video is crap ... but here it is :



Nigel

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Old 03-02-2015, 11:32 PM   #3
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I swear, foamies will fly some of the stupidest looking stuff!


OK, I got my "drone licence"...
When does the season start and what Ammo can I use?
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Old 03-03-2015, 12:50 AM   #4
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Looked like angry bird got angry !
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Old 03-03-2015, 08:39 AM   #5
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I have a better motor ordered .... recut to take a 1300 lipo to push the CoG fwd - the 800 will not be enough for the new motor.

My overall impression is the motor was just not enough ... and thrust line needed to be more down.

I'm determined to get it to work .... whether she gets angry or not!
Nigel

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Old 03-03-2015, 07:11 PM   #6
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She now has an Emax 2822 1200 motor fitted ... and with the flexi GWS 8x6 ... 3S ..... the vertical pull is more than enough to do vertical out of hand !!

The 2822 is actually the motor put aside for my Hummer 3D machine just ordered .... I have a 2212 1534kv ordered to eventually go in the Angry Bird ....

Nigel

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Old 03-03-2015, 11:04 PM   #7
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I too would like to see this thing fly. Are you intending it for reqular, aerobatic or 3D flight?

OK, I got my "drone licence"...
When does the season start and what Ammo can I use?
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Old 03-03-2015, 11:29 PM   #8
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Its purely a bit of fun .... if I can get it to fly as well as the other guys which prompted this build - I'll be happy.

His actually 3d's very well.

Nigel

222kph PKJ,EDF Concorde, Mini4,Mig3,T45,PKJ twin,ME109,Edge540,Cessna182,Skymaster Biplane,F15,F16,Badius,Ultimate,SE5,Qbee10,450 Heli,V911,J3 Cub Founder 9x forum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Flysky_RC_radio/
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Old 03-04-2015, 07:18 PM   #9
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Well the new motor made a big difference but before I could get her really going - she clipped the tall bracken just after launch ... she had a definite right yaw bias and needs that adjusted out + a few clicks of up elevator to get her up out of the crap !!

To be honest I was so amazed that she flew out of hand - I didn't react quick enough !!

She's back together again and another go tmrw !

I'm in Airport flying other stuff as well - so she can have a few mins of my time !!

Nigel

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Old 03-30-2015, 08:52 AM   #10
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Well the guys I fly with, who have Angry Birds ... took pity on me and gave me a copy of their plans.
I will try and scan them and then attach here.

I have a video of the pair doing a crazy duel this last weekend ... poor quality video I'm afraid but you can see they fly well. Will edit and upload shortly.

Motor for the new one : HK Donkey motor, 1550kv, 3s 800 - 1300 pack, 7*4.5 SF prop or a 6*4 if that's too much.

Will post ....

Nigel

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Old 03-30-2015, 07:08 PM   #11
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Here's a quickie vid I tried to shoot last weekend of the 'duo' .... I was basically busy with own gear - then heard them in the air ... grabbed my old rubbish Digicam ... so sorry about the lack of quality ... and hard to aim as screen is hard to see in sun...



Nigel

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Old 03-30-2015, 08:00 PM   #12
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Nigel,

I have a couple of Angry Bird plans I've accumulated over a period of time. Not sure if either of these is the one you built but maybe someone can use them...

Don


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Old 03-30-2015, 11:25 PM   #13
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Your second plan has the model seen in the video.

Tks for the uploads - saves me scanning !

I've built mine .... but the Donkey motor is not enough to give 1:1 .... its about 0.8:1 .... good to fly but verticals will be limited.
If I change to the 2812 motor I have - will need more than the 800 battery. Tried different props but 6*4 gave best result.

Nigel

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Old 03-31-2015, 09:25 AM   #14
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Nigel, Ive played around quite a bit with models similar to this design - models with a relatively LARGE fuselage side area and very low aspect ratio "wings".

They can have some very odd flying characteristics and if the union of fuse and wing are not right they can be a handful to fly.

There are two main issues.

1) Those low aspect wings seem to like CG positions well forward of a normal wing. 15% is pretty typical but I have had models that needed the CG as far forward as 10% of the cord for "wings" with a very low aspect ratio = well under .25/1 - meaning the cord was more than 4 times the wing span.

These are models like the flying surfer dude, some of my bat cars and other flying cars, flying saucers, flying pizza boxes, Otto's flying man series, etc.

You might think you have a very safe CG when in fact your flying a tail heavy beast.

2) The second issue is one that is even less common and that is when the fuselage side area is close to or even greater than the wing area - like on these "birds".

What is often over looked is that the fuse - on any model - acts like a wing in the yaw axis. Your fuse also has an ideal "CG point" for optimum yaw stability just like a wing has an optimum CG position for pitch stability.

Think of the fuse as another very low aspect ratio wing standing on edge. The length of the fuse is the "cord" and the height of the fuse is the wing "span".

On a typical model, the fuse CG point is of course exactly the same as it is on the wing. The model balances where it balances. That usually ends up with the fuse CG being pretty far "forward" so the yaw stability is good. One thing that helps a lot is the distribution of the side area. Most fuses have the hi point of the fuse (maximum side area) near the CG and then add a relatively large rudder way in back to offset that.

You may have noticed that the best models for knife edge flight have tall fuses with relatively large side area and even "side force generators". That extra vertical area helps them "fly" on the fuse when the wing is vertical.

The bottom line is that a typical fuse is very stable in yaw to the point we dont normally even have to think about it.

However - when we get into models like the angry bird, things are very different as far as yaw stability and fuse side area.

In your Angry bird for example, the fuse looks to me likes its side area is actually larger than your wing area.

That means your fuse has more ability - more power - to dictate the direction of flight - and its stability - than your wing does.

Even if the CG point on your wing is "good" it may not be so good as far as the fuse is concerned - all because of the relatively large fuse side area.

Imagine flying a model that was NOT stable in yaw. Imagine flying a model that was "tail heavy" in the yaw direction. The slightest change in yaw input suddenly gets exaggerated all out of proportion.

The only way to fix that behavior is to move the wing - and the CG - forward so that the fuse is also happy with the CG position.

By the way, with these weird rounded and odd ball wings, you cant really measure CG as a % of cord. It works much better to go by % of wing or fuselage area thats forward of the CG point. So when I say the CG is at 15%, I mean 15% of the wing or fuse area is forward of the CG point.

I highly suspect something like this is why your having trouble flying that bird. Anyway, its something to think about.

I think I need a signature.
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Old 03-31-2015, 09:26 AM   #15
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Oh - and at least I didnt suggest you switch to digital servos to "cure" the problem

I think I need a signature.
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Old 03-31-2015, 09:42 AM   #16
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Some of my odd ball birds that helped me come to the conclusions above

These are all either low aspect ratio wings or large side area fuses or some of both.


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I think I need a signature.
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Old 03-31-2015, 10:57 AM   #17
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My Bird had same area wing / fuselage based on 50cm diameter. But once cutting to make surfaces - this altered and progressed to a larger difference than initially imagined.

The problem was indeed CoG longitudinally and vertical. Now I see my Pals plan in hand ... the CoG is markedly forward. It pretty well falls through the prop line.

I have made a hole through the top of fuselage in line with CoG and a Cocktail Stick through allows me to check balance .....

I have slung ESC, Rx ans servos just under C/L through model ... with LiPo sitting just in front of motor over C/L ... to try and get Vertical CoG near C/L but not above. I want her to naturally hang 'claws down' ! But still have manoeuvrability of near zero offset.

She's now made up as per plan ... smaller of course.

Now just wait weather.

I have a 2805 2800kv motor waiting in the wings for delivery of ordered 1000mAh 2S LiPo's to swap into her ... suitable to run 5 - 6" prop. That should improve the Power to Weight ratio without adding weight.

Nigel

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Old 08-03-2017, 08:13 AM   #18
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Old 08-03-2017, 10:12 AM   #19
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Mine never did fly !!

I will be trying again !!

Nigel

222kph PKJ,EDF Concorde, Mini4,Mig3,T45,PKJ twin,ME109,Edge540,Cessna182,Skymaster Biplane,F15,F16,Badius,Ultimate,SE5,Qbee10,450 Heli,V911,J3 Cub Founder 9x forum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Flysky_RC_radio/
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Old 08-03-2017, 11:46 AM   #20
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Old 08-08-2017, 02:55 PM   #21
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Old 08-10-2017, 08:12 AM   #22
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Old 08-10-2017, 02:54 PM   #23
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Old 08-15-2017, 10:08 AM   #24
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