Sky Fly Owners, AEAJR asks your help
05-01-2006, 01:58 PM
#1
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Location: NY, USA
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Sky Fly Owners, AEAJR asks your help
Sky Fly owners, we need your help!
I happen to think the Sky Fly is a pretty nice plane for beginners and have
endorsed it. However Hobbico does not publish a rated range for the radio
system. That concerns me as your great new plane could quickly become a
"fly away" because you got outside the range.
I did write to Hobbico and received a response that said the range was 500
feet. I am not confident that this is correct with concerns that it might
be over stated. A range of 500 would be adequate for this plane but you can
still over fly it if you are not careful. I would much rather it have a
useful range of 1000 feet. Then I would be more confident that people would
be less likely to over fly it.
If you have a Sky Fly, and a large enough field, and a friend to help, I am
asking you to do this test and report back so your fellow Sky Fly owners can
fly in confidence. This is an example of the community helping itself.
When Spektrum released the DX6 radio without a rated range, the community
started testing its range and established a safe working range even though
the company did not provide one. I am asking your help to do the same for
the Sky Fly.
CHECKING FOR MAXIMUM GROUND RADIO RANGE
The procedure I am going to outline is a ground check. This is the range
the radio and receiver can reliably work while the plane is on or near the
ground. In general, you will get a little better range in the air, but
ground range is a good guide.
You will need help for this.
Have your friend put the plane on the ground with the SIDE of the plane facing
you. Sitting on a wood or plastic table would be even better as it gets it
off the ground a bit which provides better signal and reduces any ground
blanking effect. FM is a line of sight system which means if something
comes between the radio and the receiver it can potentially block the signal.
Any kind of metal table could affect the signal giving you either a false
long or short range reading. Your friend can hold it but this will effect
the signal somewhat. Just don't touch the antenna. In fact, if you don't
have something to sit it on, ask your friend to try to hold it by the nose
area and away from his/her body. Secure the plane so it can't move.
First, perform a range check according to the guidelines in the manual.
This will confirm that the radio and receiver are working properly.
Now, with the radio antenna up and the radio and plane powered up, walk away
and count your paces. For an adult, 20 steps should be between 40 and 60
feet. Taller people will be closer to 60 feet, shorter closer to 40. You judge, or pull
out a tape measure and pace off 50 feet and see how many steps it took.
So, if 20 steps = 50 feet, 200 steps should be about 500 feet. Plus or
minus 10% here is not going to be important if we get a lot of people doing
the test and reporting in.
Step off 100 feet and check control. Make sure the plane is held in place. Your
friend's job is to hold the plane, or to let you know if the test proves
successful. Agree on a test sequence ahead of time.
Rudder left, then right
Elevator up then down
Motor on 1/4
Rudder left and right
Elevator up and down
Motor to full 2 seconds, then off
Walk another 100 feet. Test again.
If shouting is not going to work, use cell phones to talk. If the plane
starts to act odd and uncontrolled, your friend should alert you. If you
have the radio behind your body as you walk, so the radio can not "see" the
plane, this can reduce the signal, so turn and face the plane to test.
The antenna should be straight up. Don't point the tip at the plane as this
is the worst possible signal position. Antenna up and you looking at the
SIDE of the plane gives you the best signal and that is what we want to
test.
See if you can get to 500 feet and still maintain control. Can you go
further? Try in 50 foot increments. Keep going till you lose control of the
plane or you run out of room.
If you get to the edge of your flying space, then you know you can fly
that space in confidence. If you can not get to the edge of your flying
space before losing control, then you know you have to be careful about
range.
Let us know how far you walked. If you got to a point where you
finally lost control, that is the end of your flying range.
I am assuming that you will have a little better range in the air than you will for this
test, but flying at the edge of your effective range can be risky. Try to
stay at less than 3/4 of your tested range to be confident.
My hope is that the ground check will come up closer to 1000 feet or more.
If we get 1000 feet, then I would say 700 feet is about your safe max range.
If we get 500 feet, then I would say about 350 feet is your safe maximum range.
Hopefully the 500 feet Hobbico sent me is a very very conservative number
and the actual radio range is better than that.
RANGE MARKINGS
How do you judge your range when you are flying. This test can
help with that also.
Take a sharpie with you, or some other dark permanent marker that has a
sharp edge.
Put a piece of light color making tape on the top of your radio so that one
edge of the tape is ligned up with the base of the antenna. At each 100 foot
stop point, after you test the range, have your friend hold
the plane so the top of the wing is facing you. Hold the radio out at arms
length. Line up the bottom of the antenna with one edge of the wing. Now mark
the tape where you see the the other edge of the wing. That is what you wing span
looks like at that distance.
I suggest you do this every 100 feet as 50 feet might be too small.
What you will end up with is a series of marks on top of the radio. When
the plane is in the air, just hold your radio up and see which mark
approximates your wing span as the plane is flying toward you or
away from you. This will give you a rough estimate, but close enough for your
purposes. Now you can more accurately estimate your distance to the plane.
This might also be helpful if you are about to crash at some distance. Do a quick
range check so you have a better idea of how far out the plane went down.
So, will you pitch in and help? I hope so!
I happen to think the Sky Fly is a pretty nice plane for beginners and have
endorsed it. However Hobbico does not publish a rated range for the radio
system. That concerns me as your great new plane could quickly become a
"fly away" because you got outside the range.
I did write to Hobbico and received a response that said the range was 500
feet. I am not confident that this is correct with concerns that it might
be over stated. A range of 500 would be adequate for this plane but you can
still over fly it if you are not careful. I would much rather it have a
useful range of 1000 feet. Then I would be more confident that people would
be less likely to over fly it.
If you have a Sky Fly, and a large enough field, and a friend to help, I am
asking you to do this test and report back so your fellow Sky Fly owners can
fly in confidence. This is an example of the community helping itself.
When Spektrum released the DX6 radio without a rated range, the community
started testing its range and established a safe working range even though
the company did not provide one. I am asking your help to do the same for
the Sky Fly.
CHECKING FOR MAXIMUM GROUND RADIO RANGE
The procedure I am going to outline is a ground check. This is the range
the radio and receiver can reliably work while the plane is on or near the
ground. In general, you will get a little better range in the air, but
ground range is a good guide.
You will need help for this.
Have your friend put the plane on the ground with the SIDE of the plane facing
you. Sitting on a wood or plastic table would be even better as it gets it
off the ground a bit which provides better signal and reduces any ground
blanking effect. FM is a line of sight system which means if something
comes between the radio and the receiver it can potentially block the signal.
Any kind of metal table could affect the signal giving you either a false
long or short range reading. Your friend can hold it but this will effect
the signal somewhat. Just don't touch the antenna. In fact, if you don't
have something to sit it on, ask your friend to try to hold it by the nose
area and away from his/her body. Secure the plane so it can't move.
First, perform a range check according to the guidelines in the manual.
This will confirm that the radio and receiver are working properly.
Now, with the radio antenna up and the radio and plane powered up, walk away
and count your paces. For an adult, 20 steps should be between 40 and 60
feet. Taller people will be closer to 60 feet, shorter closer to 40. You judge, or pull
out a tape measure and pace off 50 feet and see how many steps it took.
So, if 20 steps = 50 feet, 200 steps should be about 500 feet. Plus or
minus 10% here is not going to be important if we get a lot of people doing
the test and reporting in.
Step off 100 feet and check control. Make sure the plane is held in place. Your
friend's job is to hold the plane, or to let you know if the test proves
successful. Agree on a test sequence ahead of time.
Rudder left, then right
Elevator up then down
Motor on 1/4
Rudder left and right
Elevator up and down
Motor to full 2 seconds, then off
Walk another 100 feet. Test again.
If shouting is not going to work, use cell phones to talk. If the plane
starts to act odd and uncontrolled, your friend should alert you. If you
have the radio behind your body as you walk, so the radio can not "see" the
plane, this can reduce the signal, so turn and face the plane to test.
The antenna should be straight up. Don't point the tip at the plane as this
is the worst possible signal position. Antenna up and you looking at the
SIDE of the plane gives you the best signal and that is what we want to
test.
See if you can get to 500 feet and still maintain control. Can you go
further? Try in 50 foot increments. Keep going till you lose control of the
plane or you run out of room.
If you get to the edge of your flying space, then you know you can fly
that space in confidence. If you can not get to the edge of your flying
space before losing control, then you know you have to be careful about
range.
Let us know how far you walked. If you got to a point where you
finally lost control, that is the end of your flying range.
I am assuming that you will have a little better range in the air than you will for this
test, but flying at the edge of your effective range can be risky. Try to
stay at less than 3/4 of your tested range to be confident.
My hope is that the ground check will come up closer to 1000 feet or more.
If we get 1000 feet, then I would say 700 feet is about your safe max range.
If we get 500 feet, then I would say about 350 feet is your safe maximum range.
Hopefully the 500 feet Hobbico sent me is a very very conservative number
and the actual radio range is better than that.
RANGE MARKINGS
How do you judge your range when you are flying. This test can
help with that also.
Take a sharpie with you, or some other dark permanent marker that has a
sharp edge.
Put a piece of light color making tape on the top of your radio so that one
edge of the tape is ligned up with the base of the antenna. At each 100 foot
stop point, after you test the range, have your friend hold
the plane so the top of the wing is facing you. Hold the radio out at arms
length. Line up the bottom of the antenna with one edge of the wing. Now mark
the tape where you see the the other edge of the wing. That is what you wing span
looks like at that distance.
I suggest you do this every 100 feet as 50 feet might be too small.
What you will end up with is a series of marks on top of the radio. When
the plane is in the air, just hold your radio up and see which mark
approximates your wing span as the plane is flying toward you or
away from you. This will give you a rough estimate, but close enough for your
purposes. Now you can more accurately estimate your distance to the plane.
This might also be helpful if you are about to crash at some distance. Do a quick
range check so you have a better idea of how far out the plane went down.
So, will you pitch in and help? I hope so!
Last edited by AEAJR; 05-01-2006 at 02:20 PM.
05-08-2006, 08:31 AM
#2
Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Stationed in Okinawa, Japan.
Posts: 25
Sky Fly Range
I found out the hard way that the range for my Sky Fly was approximately 500'-600'. When I reached the "range limit" (unknown to me at the time), it spiraled out of control at an altitude of about 75' to the hard packed earth beneath it. It was like I lost total control of the plane and was unable to recover.
05-08-2006, 11:06 PM
#4
Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Stationed in Okinawa, Japan.
Posts: 25
Sky Fly Receiver Range
Now tha t Ithink about it and using our site diagrams, it was approximately 500' (give or take about 10'). I am confident our site lay-out plans a very accurate, so 500' is my final answer. I have been thinking of buying aftermarket electronics to install in the ol' fly to increase the range of her.
05-09-2006, 02:51 AM
#5
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: NY, USA
Posts: 5,873
I think you will have to spend a bunch as you will have to replace everything.
My suggestion is learn from the experience, and keep it in range. Spend the money on the next plane.
Preferably one that uses the same batteries.
My suggestion is learn from the experience, and keep it in range. Spend the money on the next plane.
Preferably one that uses the same batteries.
05-09-2006, 02:33 PM
#7
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: NY, USA
Posts: 5,873
Originally Posted by tcaseyrochester
I will do the test tonight and report back...
Again, 500 feet for a plane of this size is disappointing to me, not because you can't successfully fly in 500 feet, but because the plane can be comfortably flow further than that. But if we know what a reliable range is, we can make sure others know and everyone can enjoy the plane in safety.
tcaseyrochester, we look forward to your report.
05-23-2006, 05:29 PM
#8
Member
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 23
I don't know how much this will help, but I too didn't know what the range was for this plane. But I have consistantly flown it to what I would estimate ~300 vertically, plus another ~100-150ft horizontal ground distance . I did that with no sign of control loss. The plane was basically a small "X" in the sky, roughly the size of the antenna tip button or less at arm's length. As far as I can tell in my experience, the range is adequete since any further/higher and I would not be able to see the plane and lose it in the sky.
Since then I've broken about 7 inches of the receiver's antenna wire that sticks out of the tail, so I think that may now have reduced the range even more, but I've got to repair the plane before I can confirm exactly what the impact is.
Since then I've broken about 7 inches of the receiver's antenna wire that sticks out of the tail, so I think that may now have reduced the range even more, but I've got to repair the plane before I can confirm exactly what the impact is.
05-29-2006, 02:23 AM
#9
New Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: VA, USA
Posts: 15
Comfortable operating range for the SKYFKY is about 700ft. This was tested in both ground tests and flight tests using my new toy a Laser range finder....I had to tape mylar to the wings to get a good signiture...Stealthy little beast!!! Really small target at that range and wasn't any fun to fly b/c of the plane size.
And by the way the worm drive "servos" in the skyfly don't like hard landings or dirt. Mine jammed and had to be removed, cleaned and realigned. Thankfully it was discovered during preflight.
And by the way the worm drive "servos" in the skyfly don't like hard landings or dirt. Mine jammed and had to be removed, cleaned and realigned. Thankfully it was discovered during preflight.
05-29-2006, 05:00 AM
#13
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Join Date: May 2006
Location: VA, USA
Posts: 15
Ed, 600 is the number we have been looking for. It is disappointing but so is the Skyflys main wing!!! I have modified mine with carbon fiber to handle the G's.
PS I did a range test on the ground and came up with about 800ft. Don't know why it's different than in the air.
PS I did a range test on the ground and came up with about 800ft. Don't know why it's different than in the air.
05-30-2006, 07:41 AM
#15
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Posts: 5,873
Thanks Texas. I was not aware of that. I don't have one of my own. My nephew has one that I have flown.
I would imagine if you slit the bottom of the wing foam and gledwd in a 1/8" dowel 12-24" long, that should help.
Where exactly does it fold?
I would imagine if you slit the bottom of the wing foam and gledwd in a 1/8" dowel 12-24" long, that should help.
Where exactly does it fold?
05-30-2006, 03:31 PM
#16
New Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: VA, USA
Posts: 15
My 1st wing folded where the yellow plastic reinforces the wings center (by the rubber bands).
THE FIX:
I used MIDWEST 5800 carbon fiber .060" rods ($3.54ea/item#MID5800 @ Tower) to reinforce my skyflys wing. Glued to the bottom of the leading edge w/ foam safe CA & epoxy. The thin rods proved flexible enough to bend around the leading edge and terminate at the trailing edge. Here's the steps:
1.Using 2 CF rods (left/right sides) start w/ 5min epoxy and glue the rods to the center of the wing. With a little force the rods will slide between the yellow plastic and foam. Make sure the rods are located on the bottom of the leading edge.
2. Using the crease on the bottom of the wings LE as a channel apply CA and fit the rod in place. The CF rods are flexible and will make the turn at the wing tips.
3.Trim excess and you're ready to fly.
Bench tests showed that an unmodified skyfly wing will flex and deflect 6" with just 5lbs of force. Given the Skyflys weight this calculated to about 3.65G'S. Not a very strong wing at all!!!
The modified wing proved much better. The new wing held 17lbs with a 6" deflection. Calculates to about 10G's. The wing has been flown 10 times with a noticable difference in performance due to the now ridged airfoil. Wing flutter is almost elininated even under high loading!!!
THE FIX:
I used MIDWEST 5800 carbon fiber .060" rods ($3.54ea/item#MID5800 @ Tower) to reinforce my skyflys wing. Glued to the bottom of the leading edge w/ foam safe CA & epoxy. The thin rods proved flexible enough to bend around the leading edge and terminate at the trailing edge. Here's the steps:
1.Using 2 CF rods (left/right sides) start w/ 5min epoxy and glue the rods to the center of the wing. With a little force the rods will slide between the yellow plastic and foam. Make sure the rods are located on the bottom of the leading edge.
2. Using the crease on the bottom of the wings LE as a channel apply CA and fit the rod in place. The CF rods are flexible and will make the turn at the wing tips.
3.Trim excess and you're ready to fly.
Bench tests showed that an unmodified skyfly wing will flex and deflect 6" with just 5lbs of force. Given the Skyflys weight this calculated to about 3.65G'S. Not a very strong wing at all!!!
The modified wing proved much better. The new wing held 17lbs with a 6" deflection. Calculates to about 10G's. The wing has been flown 10 times with a noticable difference in performance due to the now ridged airfoil. Wing flutter is almost elininated even under high loading!!!
05-30-2006, 04:38 PM
#17
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Join Date: Aug 2005
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Originally Posted by mdp17681
My 1st wing folded where the yellow plastic reinforces the wings center (by the rubber bands).
THE FIX:
THE FIX:
How long are the rods you add?
05-30-2006, 06:00 PM
#18
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Join Date: May 2006
Location: VA, USA
Posts: 15
The rods purchased from tower are 40" long. I use 2 and joined them under the yellow plastic wing center. Excess is trimmed after the rods are securely attached to the wing. This is a critical step if you plan on wrapping the rod around the edge of the wing tip to the trailing edge as I did. You need the leverage from the excess rod to hold the bend in place while the glue sets.
You could probably gain similar strength by using a single 40" rod since the Skyflys wingspan is similar in length. However by using 2 rods I was able to give the wing tips more protection against road rash during landings.
You could probably gain similar strength by using a single 40" rod since the Skyflys wingspan is similar in length. However by using 2 rods I was able to give the wing tips more protection against road rash during landings.
08-01-2006, 10:00 AM
#21
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Join Date: Aug 2005
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Posts: 5,873
Originally Posted by AEAJR
Sky Fly owners, we need your help!
I did write to Hobbico and received a response that said the range was 500
feet. I am not confident that this is correct with concerns that it might
be over stated. A range of 500 would be adequate for this plane but you can
still over fly it if you are not careful. I would much rather it have a
useful range of 1000 feet. Then I would be more confident that people would
be less likely to over fly it.
If you have a Sky Fly, and a large enough field, and a friend to help, I am
asking you to do this test and report back so your fellow Sky Fly owners can
fly in confidence. This is an example of the community helping itself.
I did write to Hobbico and received a response that said the range was 500
feet. I am not confident that this is correct with concerns that it might
be over stated. A range of 500 would be adequate for this plane but you can
still over fly it if you are not careful. I would much rather it have a
useful range of 1000 feet. Then I would be more confident that people would
be less likely to over fly it.
If you have a Sky Fly, and a large enough field, and a friend to help, I am
asking you to do this test and report back so your fellow Sky Fly owners can
fly in confidence. This is an example of the community helping itself.
The antenna on mine was even damaged so I had to fly it with one section 1/2 down and still no problems.
09-20-2006, 08:21 PM
#22
Super Contributor
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,050
Wondering outloud if some of the "range" problems were actually interference from other sources of 27 MHZ. I have never been a big fan of 27 MHZ for air but the SkyFly is a slick plane with a nice landing gear. I bought the plane because it appeared to have a superior radio for both my son and I to learn on.
Conflicting info about radio range. I'll have to do some range testing with the antenna down. (If I can get 300 feet with the antenna down it has a reasonable shot at 1000 feet with the antenna fully extended.) At anything greater than ~700' I'm not sure if it matters whether the radio failed or you just can't tell which way it was going. Either way it is doomed.
CONTROL LIMITATIONS
First flight (hand toss) was uneventful although the controls felt mushy compared to other planes I have flown.
Biggest disappointent is that there does not seem to be much if any difference in control throw between Expert and Beginner mode. Still sorting out whether this is a servo / control design issue or due to an overly stiff foam hinge. (I tried the packing pape hinge mod but the servos/fishing line are still fighting against the resistance of the control surface hinges + rubber band.)
Next mod will be to try real hinges as posted elsewhere on this site.
MICRO PUSH RODS
Anyone ever try micro push rods on a SkyFly like the setup on the Firebird Freedom?
Clint
Conflicting info about radio range. I'll have to do some range testing with the antenna down. (If I can get 300 feet with the antenna down it has a reasonable shot at 1000 feet with the antenna fully extended.) At anything greater than ~700' I'm not sure if it matters whether the radio failed or you just can't tell which way it was going. Either way it is doomed.
CONTROL LIMITATIONS
First flight (hand toss) was uneventful although the controls felt mushy compared to other planes I have flown.
Biggest disappointent is that there does not seem to be much if any difference in control throw between Expert and Beginner mode. Still sorting out whether this is a servo / control design issue or due to an overly stiff foam hinge. (I tried the packing pape hinge mod but the servos/fishing line are still fighting against the resistance of the control surface hinges + rubber band.)
Next mod will be to try real hinges as posted elsewhere on this site.
MICRO PUSH RODS
Anyone ever try micro push rods on a SkyFly like the setup on the Firebird Freedom?
Clint
09-20-2006, 08:59 PM
#23
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Join Date: Aug 2005
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Originally Posted by cbatters
CONTROL LIMITATIONS
First flight (hand toss) was uneventful although the controls felt mushy compared to other planes I have flown.
Biggest disappointent is that there does not seem to be much if any difference in control throw between Expert and Beginner mode. Clint
First flight (hand toss) was uneventful although the controls felt mushy compared to other planes I have flown.
Biggest disappointent is that there does not seem to be much if any difference in control throw between Expert and Beginner mode. Clint
09-20-2006, 09:10 PM
#24
Super Contributor
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,050
Originally Posted by AEAJR
There is no difference. Beginner adds in up elevator on rudder. Expert does not.
I'll test this again tonight but I'm pretty sure this description is accurate.
Clint
